Why We Love Dirty Underwear!

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On this week's podcast, panty-peddler, Lacey Bloom, joins Jess to talk about her experience selling used underwear online. What makes it so exciting and how can used underwear help to destigmatize sexual taboos? They also chat about wild requests, bodily discharge, personal kinks and finding pleasure in the mundane.

Listen to Lacey weekly on The Sofia Gray Show. Follow Sofia Gray on Twitter, Instagram & Facebook.

We also sat down with Sofia Gray rep, Zak Callen, to get to know the brand a little better. Check out their Q&A below!

1. Why did you launch Sofia Gray?

Sofia Gray was started by a group of young entrepreneurs, who had a real interest in the adult industry. They saw that a safe and secure, well designed, quality marketplace did not exist for used underwear. Hence, Sofia Gray was born.

2. Who uses Sofia Gray - on the buying and selling side? 

The demographics are pretty clear cut, the majority of our sellers are female 18-35 and the majority of our buyers are male 25-45.

3. Why would someone want to buy used panties? 

There are several reasons why someone would want to buy used underwear:

a) It's a kink. Several buyers are turned on the by smell, feel and sometimes even taste of used underwear, which means buying such an item is a no-brainer to them.

b) The sellers. Some buyers have a real connection or infatuation with certain sellers, so much so that they want and sometimes feel they need to buy underwear from this person, to feel close to them or even support them.

c) For you. Buyers also enjoy the idea of the underwear being worn for them. A lot of the time, sellers will take custom requests where they'll wear specific pairs of underwear a specific way for a specific buyer. It makes the whole experience very personal.

I think the reason each buyer actually purchases underwear is unique to them, the above is just a general overview.

4. How much does the average pair trade for?

The average pair ranges from $20-50.

5. Are there any strategies that tend to garner top dollar (e.g. wearing the panties for a specific period of time, sharing personal stories or pics)?

The best way to gain good traction selling underwear is by creating a quality profile and being social. A quality profile consists of a descriptive bio, high quality images, several items for sale with an array of different styles, scents, colours etc., different price points for items, listing new items regularly, interacting with buyers and so much more. A lot of people think this a "get rich quick" scheme, but you are essentially starting your own business, you have to put the effort in.

6. Can you share a few of the most unusual (titillating) requests you’ve received from buyers?

I think the most unusual request that we receive fairly regularly is underwear that's been defecated in. Of course this is something that is strictly prohibited on the site for hygienic and shipping reasons.

7. If you’re curious about selling, but feel reticent due to social stigma, what advice or support do you offer?

If this makes you feel uncomfortable in any way, it really isn't the industry for you. Selling your underwear is intended to make you feel liberated, sexy and empowered, if you're embarrassed, it's clearly not something you should be dabbling in. That being said, if anonymity is your issue, you can remain completely anonymous while selling your underwear, you don't have to use your real name or show pictures of your face.

8. Do folks of all genders sell/buy on your site or is it primarily men buying from women?

Generally it is men buying from women, however, we get people of all genders and orientations using the site as both buyers and sellers.

***

Be sure to listen to the podcast and let us know if selling or buying used panties appeals to you.

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Rough Transcript:

This is a computer-generated rough transcript, so please excuse any typos. This podcast is an informational conversation and is not a substitute for medical, health or other professional advice, diagnosis or treatment. Always seek the services of an appropriate professional should you have individual questions or concerns.

Why We Love Dirty Underwear!

00:00:05 - 00:05:18

You're listening to the sacs with Dr Jess podcast sacks and relationship advice you can use tonight. Hey Jessica Riley here. I am here in Los Angeles California in town for a couple of speaking events and today I'm joined by other than Lacey Bloom panty peddler among other things performer and actress actor writer. What does it mean to be? A panty peddler. Oh well let me tell you know it's It's really interesting. Actually I I not only host the USA FIA Gray podcast along with my partner in Crime Tracy Bust But I sell my used underwear online on Sophia dot com. And how did you get into this? How did you even find this? And should I be selling my underwear? Okay well the second the answer. The second question is yes you absolutely a shade and anybody can which is the beauty of it but I actually. I think I came into things a little bit backwards you know. We have a lot of people who come to Sofia great dot com and they are either buyers or sellers or both and they're looking to either make a little bit extra money by selling their underwear which is kind of the mind frame. I had they are looking to buy underwear you know. They have a fetish at king for US underwear. And that's the perfect place to go for that. But I actually came into the podcast. I I'm podcast host by trade and when I was hired by Sophia Gray I thought well I need to know about this company that I'm working for and when I found out it was a company the largest online marketplace. My new that sells used underwear. I thought well I could do that. Like why not really I mean I find research and education like the sexiest thing so I did my research. I looked at all sorts of people who are selling their underwear on Sofia grey. I looked at what people are interested in buying and I just decided that it made sense for me to sign up to and so my underwear. And so do you sell used underwear to add. How used do they want? It like are their desires for people to purchase underwear. That you've worn one. Yeah ten times or Yeah Yeah No. It's honestly I mean for me. It's like it seems like the more the more moist the better I know people don't love the word moist but Yeah no it's it's it's interesting you will actually I haven't been as avid on the site lately as I was before I started doing the podcasting. But I do plan on getting back into it but you will actually receive requests from buyers at times wanting to kind of build this personal connection with who they're buying used underwear from so sometimes buyers make these specific requests and contact with sellers to make a request. Like Hey I would love to buy underwear that you wear to take a hike in the Hollywood hills because there's going to be a certain element of sweat and fair moans and everything that come with that pair of underwear that you know. Maybe you wouldn't get if you just purchased a pair at target. Well here's the thing. Do you know what I'm doing later today. Because I had a cancellation. I am going to try and run not actually run. Hurry myself to the Hollywood hills for a quick hike. Well there you go I mean it's it's perfect spend to be. How much money can I make selling up her? First of all I need to put some on 'cause truth be told I'm not wearing anymore. Now you need to put. I do have some in my bag. Yeah I always have a pair in my bag that you're willing to let go because I mean that's that's the hardest thing right is letting go of a good pair of payment panatheist. That's so true. I mean I'm a Hanky Person hanky-panky yeah yeah I find them. Super Super Comfy stretchy. I tie them in a not what I do because I don't want to wear them but you never know when you need to slip them on the Aso. I tie them in a not in my bag. So that the part that comes into contact with my body with my lips is covered. I don't want them floating around my bag. There's you know like a purse cookie in their couple of person. Men Who knows what else is in there right like all the other stuff in my tax rates high them not only put them in a little a little pouch. Sure sure. That's what I usually do when I travel but hanky-panky they're expensive so just might baseline cost and I don't know how much they cost. 'cause I'm a little cheap and I buy them on sale at outlets but I think full price. Aren't those like twenty five or thirty dollars per pair? I mean yeah and that's and that's I feel like when you're buying good underwear well and let me tell you I use I kind of use this as an excuse to because generally you're gonNa make anywhere between like twenty to fifty dollars for a pair of underwear and From we've discussed this on the podcast as it being sort of like a great side Hustle.

00:05:18 - 00:10:01

A sexy side. Hustle. If you're looking for something like that where you really the the more successful sellers are the ones who create this you know. They're very active in their profile. They engage with people. They're constantly sharing photos and new merchandise and everything on their on their site as well as just I mean some people kind of can be themselves but they can also sort of create this sexy persona or character that they wanna play and I think that's what engages a lot of buyers so I mean especially somebody like you who has some celebrity status behind them. I think you could definitely get like seventy eighty dollars. A pair Okay I gotTA start buying cheaper underwear if I'm GonNa do this great or then you use the money you make from selling your use underwear to be like okay. I'm GONNA treat myself and buy myself a really nice pair of pantyhose flight. I'm so think Chinese Jamaican Chinese that I'm just like no how can save this money and invest it still a constant believer in my own in a six pack Walmart. Okay so I want to talk a little bit about why people would be interested in buying used underwear but I'm more to begin with interested in your perspective. What is exciting about it for you? Aside from the money yeah. Let's be honest you know. The money's great. That's always exciting. But I think there's something there's something to be said for somebody wanting. I think it's the same way we feel about when we're in the Badger somebody is. There's this desire element that you know. Especially I'm a full figured fat woman. I actually listen to your episode talking about fat bodies sex and was thinking. Oh God you're right you know my body's amazing. I love me like you know and the fact that somebody a stranger no less out there on the Internet wants a little bit of me to take home with them. I mean I don't know it's sexier than that like I just. I find that so hot and rewarding. I often talk about your core. Roddick feeling so the few that underlies sexual desire or interest in sex and I think for so many of us it is being desired. We feel desired. Yes it puts us in the mood for sex. Yeah because you know we want to be loved and we WANNA be wanted but there is like this base underlying factor of just wanting to be desired to so yeah completely completely identify with that and I'm thinking about for all genders because when we think about you know ciswomen so much of our social capital is rooted in being wanted and we need to do. We need to undo much of that in terms of messaging because yes our sense of self. Our sense of sexiness desire for sex can become too rooted in being wanted shore. And this can become a problem. I think about if you have a Hetero male partner. Straight man almost never get to experience being desired because people are not as in their desire. They're not as expressive about what they want with straight men so I can look at you one day as a friend and say like God you look good or you look hot and then that Dresser Houghton those heels know we can admire one another walking down the street whether you want it or not express desire for you while the time and that becomes our normalized experience even when it feels objectify even when we feel frustrated or threatened by it is it is our baseline whereas for primarily straight men on. I think gay men have a different perspective. We can talk about that in a moment. They don't get that opportunity to be wanted. So do you find is selling their underwear on the site as well they do they do we. We have people of all genders all backgrounds every orientation under the Sun. But WE I. I will say that primarily we do. Most of our sellers are female and most of our buyers are male now. I'm not sure if that means that you know. Mitt more men have an underwear fetish than women But we do. We do have representation of really everybody on the site. That's both buying and selling. That's really cool. And so if I were to go on the site and sell you mentioned posting photos to you need to post photos of your body of your face of just the underwear I imagine you. You can leave much to the imagination. Yeah well and the beauty of this website and one of the reasons you know the minds behind Sofia Grey created. The site was they wanted to have a used panty marketplace that basically touched demographic wasn't being represented in the you know can community but also that it's very safe.

00:10:01 - 00:15:05

It's very safe in that really. It's really up to you. How much information you want to share about yourself. If you WANNA put full-bodied photos of yourself wearing panties fine if you want to share just some you know beautiful shots of your behind and your your parts. That's cool too But if you just WANNA share photos of panties that's also fine. You don't. There's nothing that says that you have to reveal your name anything about your sexuality your gender it really is up to you and the site does not store your personal information. So it's it's kind of sexy in a way to have the power to be so anonymous if you want to and if you don't want to and you want to just put it all out there. I mean that's ought to the sense of escapism and the chance to play a role I think about for me. I'm not sure if this appeals to me yet I have a lot of concerns for myself just because I have a lot of followers and I do have some people who harass me but this sort of appeals to me to get to play a role like I imagine going online and telling a story that is hot and sexy and creative and maybe not true but feels truly so this is tapping into sexual fantasy. It doesn't have to be true to be hotly and in fact the more creative it is the more fictional it is oftentimes the hotter. It is because everything goes perfectly. Do Find People we've stories absolutely is that what sells the underwear you know. I mean in my experience I think there is definitely some element of storytelling and I know that having started this journey myself. I told friends about it who you know. Want to know more and they started selling bear panties and some of them have come to me to say. I'm not sure why mine aren't selling as much and we take a look at their profile and see you know it's up there and I'm like hey have some fun with it. You know this is. This is a character. This is a role you're creating for yourself and you know you can make it as much of you as you want but also remember that the people also buying the panties. I think they get more pleasure out of it by it. Also being this creative story that they get to be a part of by purchasing your underwear. So there's there's definitely I think some fun to be had with the storytelling elements and I see that being very successful. Now I see exactly what's true about every person on the Internet. None of us do but I think the beauty of sort of an underwear fetish or kink in general is this fantasy element to it. That doesn't exist with a lot of other kinks. So it's there's power in it of being able to Kinda even if you're not receiving a story from a seller creating the story yourself that goes along with it so there's no fee to sell your underwear. How do you monetize the site? So they do there is a. It's there's no fetus. Sell your underwear. However there is a membership fee. Okay so to join the site you do have to pay a small fee. Even if you're selling underwear yes okay. So on both sides you're paying a feat. Yes interesting okay. And what about requests? I'd love to hear some of the wild requests and also to begin with the important message that if you're into selling your underwear that's cool if you're into buying underwear you're perfectly normal and we again. We'll talk a little bit about aerobic associations in a moment. But what are some of the wild requests you receive? We'll have read a yeah. I have to say a lot. A lot of people seem to want sweaty. They the more the more juices the better like I feel like it only makes sense that a lot of people do request under that's been masturbated in that's been worn while you know working out at the gym doing some sort of sweaty activity We do we have received requests before about having underwear that has been poop dead. Oh are you allowed to sell that? That is actually one of the things. The site does not allow. So that is that is one of the things that they kind of have the foot down on. Not because it's not okay to want that you absolutely can want that fantasize about that. It's just that I I imagine. There's a liability issue sending feces mail a little bit more of a hijack issue as while I think and I can't imagine you're unitl United States Postal Service. Who would be up for delivering that? Can you imagine that that posts Ben postwoman that picks up your God? We can barely get our regular mail. I know I just said a Valentine's Day card that got to my friend three weeks. I know my sent two checks to Florida from Toronto about a month ago and they still haven't arrived knowing Canada. I don't know if we have this problem because I have the best mail carrier shadow to Mike Shadow to Mike. I've had wonderful. Mail carriers my entire. I guess home owning life. You're so lucky I don't know if it's because I like say hi to them and talk to them and I did something super awkward. The other day with my postman my mail carrier so I hadn't seen him since the holiday since prior to the holidays and I thought he was coming in for a hug and then I went and hunt him and he was not coming in for us.

00:15:07 - 00:20:09

I mean I'm sure people will say I should ask first and that really is true but I really read the body language as him reaching for a hug but he was actually reaching for my mailbox so Mike Got Himself a high. I don't know if Mike appreciate it the hood but he's he's really great. So yeah I can see not wanting to deliver those things via meal and of Roy right issues around bacteria and whatnot. So people want I guess the the Messier the wetter juicier and it seems like a lot of times when somebody makes like a specific request You know sometimes they want this engagement between the two of you like I want. I want to know kind of like what your day was likely. Sometimes it's as simple as somebody requesting underwear that's just been worn out. I want you to buy a pair. Wear a pair specifically for me for the entire day and you know. Tell me what your day was like like which I'm kind of like thinking I'm single right now but if I was with a partner I'm like wow that's just a sexy thing in general of like you know coming home to your partner telling them how your day was everything you did and you know that's and they find that erotic and sexy is just the fact that you were wearing this underwear while you were doing all these things whether it was grocery shopping or hiking right and yet all the smells associated all those different activities in so many of us like the smell of our own underwear short short. I remember when I was younger. And I discovered discharge so the vagina is a self cleaning oven and throughout the month and throughout your cycle it cleans itself out and so you will have this kind of colorless or white odorless or fairly neutral smelling discharge throughout the month. And I remember. I was probably in grades. Seven nine no clue what it was right. I was freaking out. Yeah 'cause it's and you feel it just sorta like what's going on what's wrong with me and we don't talk about these now. Even women in their in their forties and fifties. We'll ask me if it's okay. They've been holding this inside because we've developed so much shame and shrouded this body part in so much secrecy that we don't even ask the questions to check on our own house and of course if you have discharged that changes if you have discharged that has a very different odor more playing or if you have discharged that is looking more yellow or green. You might you WanNa get that checked out. But if we don't even talk about the normal baseline how the hell are we supposed to know when something is wrong with yourself and I've gone off on a tangent? No and it's not the same I feel like with the penis as it is with a vagina is there's an added so crazy to me even twenty twenty that this is something. I mean as simple as discharge that we don't talk about but it seems like revolving around the vagina. There's just so much mystique end. I mean what's the word for like negative mistake? It's a stigma. It's is shameful shrouded in secrecy stigma and the other day I had my period and I was out of sports game and I had to. There was no washroom onsite so to run to the coffee shop at the corner. Got It and I remember saying to somebody like I have to runner. I've gotta change my Tampon and I guess it really was off putting for them. They were like well. That's too much information but I was also explaining. Why THE HELL? I had to leave the game in the middle of a point right. Because I didn't WANNA bleed out and I know again they're going to be people listening that's TMI just but this is just our normal bodily function this function that allows for the God Damn Life Force and that's what makes it so crazy to me that this isn't something that it's something we look at at in a shameful way because I'm like this is this is the being that gives light like the things that you're welcome not that I've ever done. I'll be there but you know we're thinking and being thankful for all of the mothers and people who have Jonah's out there for the amazing work you do with those vaginas exactly. And so I think of this selling of underwear and purchasing of underwear enjoying the smell or the taste or just the feeling and the associated stories as normalizing more normalizing of this body part. And so when I ask you about the wild or outlier stories. It isn't just to sensationalize them. Although of course people wanna hear the outliers ashore but it's also a normalization so if somebody says you know what yeah I kind of like the smell when my discharge melds or mixes together with my sweat or have had a long day. I kind of like that smell. There's something soothing about it there's something calming about it. There's something erotic to about it. There's something that turns me on about alone. Exactly you're not alone. There's a whole bunch of folks out there that think and feel the exact same way you do and this is. This is exactly the kind of topic that we discussed on. The Sofia grey show is Kinda de stigmatizing kinks and fetishes. And anything that you know turns you on so long as you know it is something that's safe for both you and a consensual partner that it's there's nothing wrong with that.

00:20:09 - 00:25:04

There's an we should be having. These conversations is sort of something I thought about whether or not you would talk to your partner if you have a partner or partners and you want to sell your underwear. I was thinking that because you know in my life and my relationship I tell Brennan a lot. I don't want to tell him everything because that would be unrealistic and it's always scary when a couple times says all we tell each other everything because as soon as one walks out of the room that had oh except is one. Because you don't tell everybody or anybody everything right but I was thinking that it would be normal for me to discuss this with Brandon. And I don't feel that I would personally ask for his consent. Sir Brennan's my husband right. Yeah you probably know the podcast. Yeah and so I was thinking that other people would feel that they want their partners consent. Okay and that there's no right or wrong or black or white there's a whole bunch of nuance to this. I look at it is. It's my body it's my underwear and then I see the flip side which is if I'm interacting with someone online or in an erotic or sexual way I would like to know if that is in line with the terms of whatever relationship contract. We've negotiated and in most cases because we assume monogamy as a default or even we assume that a specific type of language like Oh we're monogamous or were flexible that a specific word speaks shorthand shore to explain everything. I think the reality is most of us have not discussed whether or not you know our partner would be comfortable with. Us selling our underwear now. Of course our partner doesn't to make that call but I would think in any relationship you want to know how your partner feels and maybe WanNa take that into consideration so I was just thinking that there must be some real gray area here and this this offer's just a reminder that everybody should be talking in long form not shorthand about what you're comfortable with in your relationship because what I'm okay with may not be okay with what may not be the same as what brands okay with may not be the same as what. Euro K where and. There's no right or wrong but I think as long as you have a discussion about what you want why you want it what your desires are and what your fears are because I think in relationships we often put down our foot and say nope this is a hard no but let's and that's obviously important to be able to say no. Can we dig deeper and say okay? Why am I so off put by this am I saying? No and usually the question is what scares me right. Oh right because of course. That's that's what it always. I'm scared if you do this. You'll fall in love with somebody else. I'm scared if you do this. You'll you know? Find Somebody sexier than me you know. I completely understand. I think I love what you said about communication between partners always but I think there's also that you need to continually communicate because defining what we're into when we start dating someone does not necessarily define what we're into or find sexy five years into a relationship with someone I mean it's the same same idea of you know when you when you engage in sexual relationship with somebody just because you start having sex doesn't mean you have to continue to have sex you know. There's this constant there needs to be constant communication that I feel like a lot of people don't have and that's why sort of people grow apart from each other is. They're not necessarily growing apart by the growing in different directions. And they're not talking about it right and you change over time. Of course I mean I hope you do. Oftentimes I hear people say like only change a accusing them of evolution and that natural evolution is what makes monogamy or any type of relationship impossible. Because you would be so bored if somebody's state. Imagine meeting when you're twenty five and being the same person when you're sixty. Ouch you exactly you your partner to change. And I think it's important to remember that you're allowed to feel uncomfortable. You're allowed to feel off PUTT. You're allowed to even express what you want but your partner doesn't always have to oblige you and partner cannot meet all of your needs and your partner cannot assuage all of your concerns. Oftentimes that's on you And so I am thinking about people who might say. Oh well this is. I wouldn't want my partner doing this. I wouldn't want them interacting. Okay that's okay if that's your first reaction but please explore beyond that Y. What threatens you about this and that doesn't mean that you have to come around. That doesn't mean you have to come around and be like you know what I got it. My deepest darkest fears and my throat's and now I'm okay with it but at least you're going to have the conversation right because I think a lot of people have the concern that if my partner wants something for example let's say it. Is You know an underwear fetish and they WANNA buy. Somebody's used underwear online. They might wonder. Why does it? My partner why am I not fulfilling this desire? That they have.

00:25:05 - 00:30:07

Is there something I can be doing differently? And that's most of the time out the case but just having these conversations and I know when I'm in a relationship I want to be a part of my partners desires like I sometimes if that's something I can't fulfil or I don't feel comfortable filling it. I want to help them find that fulfilment like how can I help you find mets? I'm not GonNa do this for you but you know what? What is it that I can do to make this happen for you? Even if I'm not you know the part of it. I love that perspective of alternatives versus compromise and understanding that you cannot meet all of your partner's needs and even when your partner has a desire that doesn't include you? It is not necessarily an indication of a deficit exactly in the relationship. Right and that deficit model is rooted in the idea of soulmates. It's rooted in the notion that if you find the right person you'll never need any though won the won the illustrious one in seven billion. Yeah what if mine is in Mongolia? That's going to be a long plane ride. I do like a plane but there is no dreamliner flight. No seven eight seven go into Mongolia so now you must hear a lot from people with regard to why they're into used underwear knows just wanted to kind of flesh out some of the totally healthy reasons so we're example for some people it's just the smell of bodily fluids it's that natural animalistic desire especially attractive. I think in a culture in which we are toning down our body's natural spots we have to cover it all up. You know it's it's so funny I may I'm performing I've performed on more than one occasion the vagina monologues cool. And there's a monologue in there. That's all about her angry vagina and how she is upset about. Why am I trying to cover up the smell of my vagina? Let there's a spray for rain. I don't want my posted this Hell Lake Rain and it's true I mean there's is really as we're trying to cover up so many things but why women natural beauty of it is just so good? Yeah exactly and so I think that's a normal a desire for just the natural bodily functions for some people wanting us. Pennies is associated with submission and humiliation so it really runs the gamut for the Association of eroticism and underway or used underwear is formed through an early or peak erotic experience. It Creates Association so if you were masturbating and you saw those underwear if you were getting turned on and you felt the kind of Silky feel those underwear you can develop what we call erotic association. This of course is one theory another theory. Is that the taboo element of something that you were forbidden. My favorite from. Yeah and it's not just underwear. There are so many other other items or potential fetishes You mentioned that sometimes fan- fantasy is simply an escape for from reality it allows you to explore themes and roles and interactions. The don't fit your lived reality and your fantasies can be at odds with your lived reality. Oh absolutely right. Oh I know for me when making always making decisions and always feeling like I'm in control and often somewhat of a position of power. That's why submission appeals to me so greatly in the bedroom. It's you know fifty percent because it's an escape from my role of having to be in control and fifty percent just cause I'm lazy and I think I think that's pretty typical. You know at least from a lot of my friends and people. I've interacted with who are in twenty four seven Daamsa relationships. A lot of them are submissive because of the fact that in their professional lives or you know outside of their personal relationship they are very dominant. They are very large and in charge. And they're like I need a I need a break. I want someone to tell me what to do like. That's absolutely fine. It's a turn on its subversive. And if you find your fantasy whether it's about used underwear or anything. If you find it particularly subversive it can also be related to the ways in which arousal can affect discussed so if you about splashing rubbing wet and messy substances like honey or pie or angel food cake all over your body or over. Your Vulva. You might be turned on by the thought of messy or sticky because as arousal levels heighten. Your disgust instincts become less sharp. Yes and so things that you once experienced as off pudding Become a turn on and there's something so hot about taking something. That is perhaps a negative way or socio culturally negative even if even if it's not naturally a negative and finding power and pleasure.

00:30:07 - 00:35:02

I mean I always think about. I'm like if I wasn't selling my used underwear my used underwear that I've sweated in that I've discharged that I'm just going about my everyday life. I would just be throwing this in the dirty clothes basket to like sit there for a week before I do laundry because I live in a building where you use corridors to pay for laundry and I'm like Oh my gosh. We're talking about a place of worship where someone is creating this fantasy and pleasure out of something. I've put on my body or a me literally throwing it in. What's basically a trash can? That is GONNA get recycled. I love that this idea of of waste your bodily magic your fluid. All that stuff reminds me of this Tonya Stevens Song to Tony. Stevens is a reggae artists. Jamaican reggae artist to me. The best that has ever existed ice. I'll take her above and Bob Marley. Even and she talks about like this guy that she can. She wants but she can't have because the world is not evolved enough to accept that they're each separate relationships but could have an additional relationship so she's Gosh she's talking about ethical non monogamy within reggae and she talks about many kind of challenging concepts not just ethical non monogamy but she talks about racism and homophobia through her music and tasked it and she talks about wanting this guy and she says something along the lines of maybe you and me could make a beautiful daughter but unfortunately it's a waste of water meaning like it's a waste of all of this energy and fluid. I don't know if people are going to get that reference Google Tonya Stevens. I definitely. I'M GONNA look her up because I the fact that's my other thing is I want these conversations to be more mainstream. I want us to have conversations and hear music and watch it on. Tv and in movies and read it in books by my huge advocate and supporter of Erotica and romance books. And everything like I love my literature. So I'm the fact that it's in music I mike. I love that. This song is called. It's a pity by Tonya Stevens. So look if I can play a clip here. I don't know what's allow I'll tell Ya. Don't have the money for the license tonio but I think that the idea of waste of. Hey let's invest in our body us. What we're producing is such a cool cool concept a cool way of looking at it maybe not for everybody absolutely absolutely and this is not an any way saying like you have to go try this like if if it doesn't work for you or you feel embarrassed by it or you know just ashamed. I mean I never want anybody to feel ashamed about anything. But then maybe it's not for you and that's okay. I mean that's the same with any KIMBER. Faddish it's not for everyone. It's not a by all like one-size-fits-all you're kinky. That does not mean you enjoy every single king that exists yes absolutely and I think that if people wanna get started they can go check out the website. See what's on their kindy. Peru's without joining. Yeah you can check it out. You can see what some people are putting up on their profiles and everything and Sophia Gray. You can find on you know all the various social media platforms. We talk a good amount about kind of the process as well as other topics on the podcast. And you'll find that a lot of people who do sell their underwear on Sophia Gray and they create these personas for themselves. You can find a lot of them on social media as well. I found twitter to be like a fantastic site specifically for people in the Kinky community to connect so. Yeah D- do your research. I love research. I think I want to try it. I don't think I want to try it as just a Riley because I I guess I just. I don't love being objectified when you're a woman and women who are six chills like me talk talking about this topic. It is so easy for people to to cross the line honestly. There's no excuse for it so when I say it's easy I'm not saying it's acceptable but it happens all the time. Yeah Being reduced to the way I look being reduced to my sexuality being reduced to just sex when in fact you know trying to help people feel better about themselves and feel better about their lives and have better sex. Shame on you. Yeah but I'd I don't WanNa be sexualize and I'm I'm I don't WanNa say in private about my sex life because if you listen to the podcast you've definitely heard me talk a little bit about my sex life but I'm not as open as some people right and it's funny because brand coaches will always tell you like all you got to share more. You've got to be more vulnerable. You have to be your more authentic self and I do feel. I'm being authentic but that doesn't mean I'm going to share one hundred percent of me. No it doesn't mean that you have to or should have to know and I think that the people who you know you folks who keep tuning in except that I share a little and I don't share everything and you know what maybe in five years I'll share more. I don't know I'm looking forward to get an old. I just turned forty happy birthday.

00:35:02 - 00:36:13

Congratulations I made it. I'm so excited to be forty. I think I hear people You know experiencing shame with age and I don't know if it's sort of my Chinese background of revering age or just the fact that like I love life. I love where I am. I feel like everything's good. I got good people in it. Knock on wood so yeah. I'm excited for aging. I'm excited to check this out. So folks can check out your podcast. The Sofia great podcast lately and it's Sophia Gray gray show. We have the website we have the we're on any podcast streaming platform I listened to Dr Jocelyn spotify and finest thirteen. Yeah absolutely so. We'll be sure to link to that. Thank you so much for sharing your story. This is a little bit different than what we normally do. And I found it really interesting by LAD. I hope people check it out whether or not it's your cup of tea. I think it's worth exploring. Yeah thank you so much and thank you to you for listening wherever you're at. I hope you're having a great one. We'll be back next Friday and every Friday with a brand new episode. You're listening to the sex with Dr Jess podcast. Improve your sex life improve your life.